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#1 2008-11-11 18:25:25
Creation - the untold story
Hey friends,
We all know the story of the big bang and evolution. It has been taught in schools, written about in newspapers and magazines, published in many books and shown in many documentaries.
If you want to gather together two sides of the argument I suggest you look here:
http://www.amazingdiscoveries.org/media … flict.html
The first video covers the big bang, dating methods and all the evidence for a global catastrophe.
I know you may have things you think are more important, but you have had your lives to hear the other story, so any amount of time you spend to listen to this is nothing in comparison.
Thanks,
Tony
Last edited by uberduber (2008-11-11 18:26:04)
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#2 2008-11-11 18:37:50
Re: Creation - the untold story
The Christian (fundamentalist) Union is that way ----> http://sucs.org/~cu/
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#3 2008-11-11 19:03:02
Re: Creation - the untold story
If you want to ridicule, watch the videos first - or you have no grounds on which to argue.
They aren't videos that just quote scripture and say "the devil put things there to test faith", no. They use logic which I am sure you can understand.
If you have no intention of watching them maybe this will be a good site ---> http://www.oprah.com/index
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#4 2008-11-11 19:49:09
- saya
- From: Swansea
Re: Creation - the untold story
rc: I dunno, it's not like *every* SUCS member is a hardcore atheist. This is general chat, can't people try and start conversation about whatever topics they want and want to discuss with others, if that's the intention like?
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#5 2008-11-11 20:34:44
Re: Creation - the untold story
They are incredibly tiring videos to watch, continually interrupting the flow of the presentation with irrelevant quotes of scripture. The (rather flawed) logic seems to basically be supported by (intentionally or otherwise) omitting large amounts of research.
For example, the presenter seems to indicate that the Big Bang theory can't be correct since it would lead to a uniform distribution of matter rather than the clumpyness we can observe today. However, the Big Bang theory doesn't predict a uniform distribution at all - the clumpy distribution has been fairly well explained by the effects of acoustic energy. Both observations and simulations support this idea.
Frankly I only managed to get about half way through the first video - the logic is so horribly flawed it's painful.
I also don't see the need to invent a _more_ complex theory (creationism) to try and explain away something that we don't yet fully understand. Occam's razor suggests that the simplest explanation is usually the best - inventing much more complex hypotheses which answer _fewer_ questions than the accepted simpler theories seems silly.
- Steve
xmpp:steve@nexusuk.org sip:steve@nexusuk.org
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#7 2008-11-11 20:49:07
Re: Creation - the untold story
Creation is actually as simple as the word.
God made everything - how can that be complex?
Men who profess to be wise have perverted the truth and tried to make everything far more complex than it actually is because they don't want to believe the creation account of the bible.
In order to make an apology for creationism now it will sound complex because there is an intricate web of complex lies that needs to be unravelled first.
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#8 2008-11-11 21:08:30
Re: Creation - the untold story
uberduber wrote:
God made everything - how can that be complex?
How was God created?
Men who profess to be wise have perverted the truth and tried to make everything far more complex than it actually is because they don't want to believe the creation account of the bible.
There is little evidence to support the bible's account over the accepted scientific theories.
- Steve
xmpp:steve@nexusuk.org sip:steve@nexusuk.org
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#9 2008-11-11 21:32:46
Re: Creation - the untold story
uberduber wrote:
Creation is actually as simple as the word.
God made everything - how can that be complex?
Don't you want to know or care how it made everything?
uberduber wrote:
Men who profess to be wise have perverted the truth and tried to make everything far more complex than it actually is because they don't want to believe the creation account of the bible.
So your right and the entire scientific establishment is wrong? Ok.. I'll start the bonfire for all the books, you round up the heretics...
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#10 2008-11-11 22:22:02
Re: Creation - the untold story
rollercow wrote:
uberduber wrote:
Creation is actually as simple as the word.
God made everything - how can that be complex?Don't you want to know or care how it made everything?
Well it was certainly divinely orchestrated. I will have a long time to find out too, I wouldn't trouble myself with it now. I don't feel the need to know so much that I will believe stories made up by scientists to make an excuse for their disbelief in creation. I think a more important question for you to ask would be where did any matter come from? Why does the universe even bother to exist? How do atoms even hold together when science tells us they shouldn't?
rollercow wrote:
uberduber wrote:
Men who profess to be wise have perverted the truth and tried to make everything far more complex than it actually is because they don't want to believe the creation account of the bible.
So your right and the entire scientific establishment is wrong? Ok.. I'll start the bonfire for all the books, you round up the heretics...
Well actually you're free to believe lies if you want. You have free will.
firefury wrote:
saya wrote:
it's not like *every* SUCS member is a hardcore atheist.
Disclaimer: I am not an atheist.
God was not created. He says he is from everlasting to everlasting. If you believe God was created then you have made up your own god.
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#11 2008-11-11 22:45:59
Re: Creation - the untold story
uberduber wrote:
Well it was certainly divinely orchestrated.
How can you be so sure?
uberduber wrote:
I don't feel the need to know so much that I will believe stories made up by scientists to make an excuse for their disbelief in creation.
I am very tempted to reply to this with "I don't feel the need to know so much that I will believe stories made up by creationists to make an excuse for their disbelief in evolution."
I presume that you would describe it as a very weak argument, but it is exactly the same argument you are using - namely the holes in your argument are irrelevant.
Moderator of the SUCS Jokes list
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#12 2008-11-11 22:47:45
Re: Creation - the untold story
uberduber wrote:
I think a more important question for you to ask would be where did any matter come from?
Bing Bang theory suggests that the matter condensed out of energy.
How do atoms even hold together when science tells us they shouldn't?
Science tells us no such thing.
God was not created. He says he is from everlasting to everlasting.
Why can you so easily accept the idea that no being created God, yet you can't begin entertain the idea that no being created the universe? There is a lot of scientific evidence showing how the universe evolved and precisely none showing the existence of an "everlasting" creator. If you are of the belief that nothing as complex as the universe can exist without having been intelligently created then presumably you are saying that God is a very simple entity?
A belief in a creator is _not_ in conflict with the current scientific theories so long as you do not take the bible's account literally - scientific theories suggest that the universe unfolded the way it has due to the various universal constants having precisely the right values, there is no reason why a creator couldn't have set these constants appropriately to get the desired result and then started the universe running - this is something that can neither be proved nor disproved. However, the literal creationist view that the scientific theories are wrong and that the world was magicked into being in 7 days _is_ at odds with the evidence.
- Steve
xmpp:steve@nexusuk.org sip:steve@nexusuk.org
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#13 2008-11-11 22:53:21
Re: Creation - the untold story
uberduber wrote:
firefury wrote:
saya wrote:
it's not like *every* SUCS member is a hardcore atheist.
Disclaimer: I am not an atheist.
God was not created. He says he is from everlasting to everlasting. If you believe God was created then you have made up your own god.
I'm not sure if quoting me like this was intentional or not, so I will clarify: I am not an atheist and I do not believe in God.
- Steve
xmpp:steve@nexusuk.org sip:steve@nexusuk.org
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#15 2008-11-11 23:27:45
Re: Creation - the untold story
uberduber wrote:
Did we evolve from a banana and worms?
Neither, although since humans, bananas and worms all share much of the same DNA it seems likely that we had a common ancestor millions of years ago.
- Steve
xmpp:steve@nexusuk.org sip:steve@nexusuk.org
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